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| Author: | Bobc [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:45 am ] |
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I have a 12-2 w ground wire running from my breaker panel to a junction box in my garage. Can I split the b & w at the breaker box to switch it to 2- 110v lines if I rewire after the junction box. I want a second 11ov line in the garage. |
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| Author: | Don Williams [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:57 am ] |
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I believe when running 110 you need a black, neutral (white) and the ground. So splitting a 220 line isn't such a great idea. You'll have to run another wire. Replace the 220 breaker with two seperate breakers. Hopefully Bruce will drop in, (our official OLF electrician) and set us straight on that, but I'm pretty sure that's the deal if you want two circuits. |
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| Author: | Bobc [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 10:13 am ] |
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Don I meant turning a 110 line into 2 110 lines by connecting the black to a breaker and the white to another breaker then at the junction box rewiring the garage using the black for one 110 and the white for the other and the ground would be common to both. |
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| Author: | Don Williams [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 10:52 am ] |
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I'm pretty sure you still need a black & white & ground for each 110 line to complete the circuit. Where's Bruce?! |
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 12:57 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Don Williams] I'm pretty sure you still need a black & white & ground for each 110 line to complete the circuit. Where's Bruce?![/QUOTE] Don you are right on that. each 110 circuit need a black white and a ground. The method he is talking about would be dangerous and not allowed by any fire code. |
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:01 pm ] |
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Bob if you have room for another circuit breaker in the box the safest thing would to be run another new circuit. If you dont you can buy a twin pole space saver breaker at home depot. This splits one loacation in the breaker box to two. This allowed and safe in most areas. 
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| Author: | Bobc [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:07 pm ] |
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Thanks Michael. I wasn't sure if this would meet code or not. The only reason I asked is because getting from the house to the garage would involve a lot of work. |
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| Author: | Alain Lambert [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:20 pm ] |
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The safe way would be to run the 220V in the garage in a small breaker panel and then install 110 V breakers in that panel and run lines from there with both black and white. But I am not an electrician! |
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:26 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Alain Lambert] The safe way would be to run the 220V in the garage in a small breaker panel and then install 110 V breakers in that panel and run lines from there with both black and white. But I am not an electrician![/QUOTE] That's the misunderstanding. he is not talking about spliting a 220 line he was talking of spliting a single 110 line into two 110's by using the white as one hot and the black as another and use the single ground as a comman for both to gain two seperate 110 lines. |
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 1:32 pm ] |
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Bob what is the 110 line you have used for and what do you plan on using on the second 110. There is a way to add a second outlet to from the junction box. But the main amperage for the two outlets would be a 15 or 20 amps combine depending on the breakers max if you use both outlets at the same time. If you exceed that it will trip. |
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| Author: | Bobc [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:49 pm ] |
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Michael I put a 10 x 14 storage shed behind my garage and I wanted to run power from the garage to the shed. I'll have a dehumidifier and a fan running and a couple of lights.The only thing I use in the garage is lights and occasionaly my chop saw. I thought I would use the second 110 line for the shed. |
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:52 pm ] |
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You could branch of the junction box with a line but I think the thing that would be a over load would be when you use the chop saw at the same time the fan and dehumidifier are running. The chop saw will draw some amp when you use it. If it was just for the lights the fan and humidifier I dont think it would be a problem. |
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| Author: | Don Williams [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 10:15 pm ] |
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Bob, if you're planning on running between buildings, you will want to use exterior rated electrical conduit, preferably pvc, underground if the distance is much at all. If they are right next to each other, still use conduit, and seal good so the conduit has a watertight entrance to both stuctures. You can branch off the other simply by using a junction box as Michael said. You'll need to have some slack wire in the grage, or you'll need to replace some. Get a metal J-box for inside the garage with some strain reliefs, and a roll of 12-2. Then get all the conduit you will need to start from inside the garage and go out to the shed. You will need connectors and sealant, or solvent, whatever the guy at Home Depot / Lowes etc recommends to run the pvc outside. How far is the shed from the garage? |
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| Author: | Bobc [ Fri Jul 14, 2006 10:40 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Michael Shaw] You could branch of the junction box with a line but I think the thing that would be a over load would be when you use the chop saw at the same time the fan and dehumidifier are running. The chop saw will draw some amp when you use it. If it was just for the lights the fan and humidifier I dont think it would be a problem.[/QUOTE] Michael that's what I thought. I think I'll have to bite the bullet and run a new line to the shed. Don the shed is behind the garage. Distance between them is 2 feet. I plan on using PVC. |
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| Author: | mhammond [ Sat Jul 15, 2006 1:48 am ] |
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Bob: Hi, I am an electrical contractor by trade. Splitting the garage circuit as you describe will work o.k. However it is generally considered to be very poor practice. You will need to be absolutely certain you get both phases on the 12-2 to the garage, otherwise you will put a double load on the ground wire which is unsafe! What happens is that over a period of time the average person tends to stretch a "stretched" circuit just one more time and you end up with a big mess. If you go ahead and run a new seperate line to the shed you will be able to sleep much better and have room for expansion at a later time. If you have any more questions I will be happy to offer assistance on any technical matters. Good luck... |
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| Author: | bob J [ Sat Jul 15, 2006 2:01 am ] |
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Bob, Don't stand in water 
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| Author: | Dickey [ Sat Jul 15, 2006 3:17 am ] |
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Hi Bob, Looks like you got some good advice. There is a way to use a 12/3 with a ground to make two 110 Circuits with two separate breakers. This is allowed based on the fact that neutral wires don't carry the load that the hot wires do. So a common neutral can suffice two circuits if all wire sizes are the same. Regardless, I agree with the above comments that safe NEC practices dictate a separate line for your shed. The NFPA is bent on saving our life and property. We don't want no charred zoot. 
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| Author: | Bobc [ Sat Jul 15, 2006 5:37 pm ] |
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Hey guys thanks for all the great advice. I decided to take the time and run a new line. Better safe than sorry.
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| Author: | Michael Shaw [ Sat Jul 15, 2006 5:39 pm ] |
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Good job Bob. We wouldnt want all that great wood damaged in an electrical fire. |
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